Actions (Commands) I would love to see implemented.

Gerald Achor's Avatar

Gerald Achor

30 Mar, 2015 02:53 PM

I know that you all are busy.

One reason I am also using Quicken 2015 is the rich repertoire of commands like Remove shares, Add Shares, and Return of Capital utilized in the Portfolio Registers. Any chance if these being implemented in Moneydance?

Thank you for your time and consideration.


  1. 1 Posted by dwg on 30 Mar, 2015 09:41 PM

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    I can agree about Quicken they have had those transaction types for many many years.

    I've been involved in post discussions many times, you can read about some of the requests:

    Stock for Stock:

    Return of Capital:

    Add/Remove shares:

    Investment transaction are something that MD is sadly lacking in (to be fair most PFM packages are) but to truly replace Quicken they are really needed. My workarounds at the moment are nasty or require extra work or spreadsheets to be maintained.


  2. 2 Posted by Gerald Achor on 30 Mar, 2015 10:02 PM

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    I know that you have been involved, Des.

    Jessica wanted me to open a discussion here on the new Site; so that she could create a ticket to attach it to the discussion. By attaching it, the IK staff could notify us when it is updated. So she states. (G) Where are you, Jessica?? (LOL)


  3. 3 Posted by dwg on 31 Mar, 2015 01:47 AM

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    Chuckle, Oh you mean another ticket.

    #3475 has been opened on this site for a while. I would hope moving to Zendesk didn't wipe all of the existing requests.

  4. 4 Posted by dwg on 31 Mar, 2015 03:50 AM

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    Let me expand if I may on these transactions type and how I need to use them in an Australian context..

    1. Add & Remove Shares

    I would use these to round of to a whole number of shares when performing dividend reinvestment. MD as does most software divides cost price into amount received to determine number of shares. Companies here round up or down in some instances.

    In the case of Mutual Funds we have funds where the fund invests in other wholesale funds, it is often too difficult (and in some cases impossible) to readily find out the unit price. The solution I've seen employed is to use a unit price of $1 always and the number of units represents the total value. Buys & sells are performed normally, but Add/Remove shares denotes changes in the value of the investment, something the various reports and graphs would have to understand. This is the way Quicken (or Reckon) works in Australia and it works quite well for suitable funds.

    1. Return of Capital.

    The lack of this has long been an annoyance. The number of transaction I have that require this is well into double digits. It is a very common transaction here and is also used when you have stapled securities, Westfield, scentre & stockland all require this for just about every dividend/distribution, a lot of other companies have provided capital returns or they are used for merger/demerger activities.

    It is also required to support negative returns of capital. This is needed for when shares have been sold on an installment basis and also for shares that were sold with partially paid up capital and the company subsequently do a capital call.

    BTW If the old support tickets have been lost I will write up the other couple of transaction types I have requested. Direct Share ownership is one of the things I'm really interested in.


  5. 5 Posted by Gerald Achor on 31 Mar, 2015 02:06 PM

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    OK, IK staff, is ticket #3475 still open? Or has it been lost with the movement of the forums back to Tender? In either case, you folks need to attach a ticket to this discussion; as Jessica so stated to me. (G)

    Now. the most needed investment action for me is Return of Capital. Already this year, I have had three Return of Capital distributions from a Security in one of my Investment Accounts. I have setup a separate Income Category of Return Capital for collection of distributions received, and have denoted in the Memo Field of each distribution that it is *Return of Capital". I guess that is all I can do. (g)


  6. 6 Posted by dwg on 31 Mar, 2015 08:23 PM

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    Return of Capital in my case usually does not result in income that is taxable in the year received rather it reduces the cost basis of the securities and that has to be taken into account when the securities are sold and thus it impacts the capital gain that is reported.


  7. 7 Posted by Gerald Achor on 31 Mar, 2015 09:15 PM

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    I think that is the case in all circumstances. Return of Capital does reduce the cost basis of a security; so has to be watched very carefully and taken into account when the security is sold. That is why we need it here, IK staff!!! (g)

    I just did not know what type of category to report the action. So since receiving it as a positive intake, I chose an income category.

    Des, how would you record a Return of Capital transaction in MD?? I not trying to put you on/in a spot. (g)


  8. 8 Posted by dwg on 01 Apr, 2015 06:20 AM

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    There is the method John Prewitt outlined to show the correct cost however in my case for each security that could amount to hundreds and hundreds of transactions, the method does stuff up any performance reporting, and it really is just too much work for shares that have multiple capital returns rather than a one off.

    I have adopted another method to show the true cost in most places (it doesn't on the cost basis report, but in effect this is just a report of purchases and sales, but in most other places it seems to work, it does however stop lot matching working at all.

    For each capital return I do a sell of 0 shares and the total amount of the return. I then transfer this to my bank account.

    To ensure I really have accurate data though I also maintain for each security that is subject to returns of capital or partial sales a custom spreadsheet. It is annoying it is extra work and a nuisance but necessary unless I was prepared to return to Quicken (Reckon) and be scr**ed by them as no other package I have found handles these transactions.

    FWIW I know of at least one situation under local taxation law where it is taxable in the year of receipt. If the cost basis reaches 0 any further capital returns are taxed in that year.


  9. 9 Posted by Gerald Achor on 01 Apr, 2015 02:51 PM

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    Des, I was beginning to smile in reading about your method of recording 0 shares as a method of recording Return of Capital. Then I read about one result you mentioned of such a transaction interfering in the utilization of the lot matching technique. Then I frowned! (LOL)

    Luckily, I am running MD in parallel with Quicken 2015 (Windows) where I can record with its action of RtrnCap the Return of Capital transaction. I would never of thought that I would start praising Quicken!! (LOL)


  10. 10 Posted by dwg on 01 Apr, 2015 09:00 PM

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    The problems around Quicken mostly revolve around Intuit and in my case Reckon and in their methods, actions and attitudes. From a software perspective Quicken is pretty thorough in how it handles Investment transactions, even if it is not always obvious, you do get the correct results. I can do more with MoneyDance reporting, even though I would love to be able to take it further, but then I would need to be able to create a custom report to cope with things like the treatment of capital gains under local laws. I have also been able to customize MD to meet local Taxation reporting requirements to a significant degree.

    The Quicken product itself is the benchmark in many areas and while it has much bloat the ability to handle the various transaction types is currently unmatched. MoneyDance has so much promise but to truly be the competitor is should be it needs to be able to handle the transaction types you see and need in the various areas. In General Banking, credit cards and the like I do not see too many problems but in Investments lots of holes, I would like to see them start by fixing/completing mutual fund and direct share ownership transactions then they could move into options, futures and other types less used by the personal investor. In reality there probably are not a vast number of transaction types needed.

    Note I am aiming Moneydance at the top of the line personal Quicken (Reckon) product, it list at about $105 in the U.S. In Australia the top of the line product costs $250 and gives 2 years worth of share price updates or $125 per year for the annual version.

    MD does have the capability to well and truly compete, by returning to the Tender forums they can have one of the best levels of support in the industry as we have seen in the past, the product capability now needs to be enhanced to bring it up to the right level and I believe that MD needs to be a complete Personal Financial Management software, that way it can justify a reasonable price - it doesn't want to be on the level of $20 software and by being a premier software it attracts people who might not need it today but can grow into it and with increasing emphasis on retirement savings and the like many people could use such a product.

    I'll get off my soapbox now :)


  11. 11 Posted by Scott Meehan on 03 Apr, 2015 05:58 PM

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    Hi Jerry,

    Ticket #3475 is still open, so I've attached it to this discussion and the developers are looking into it.

    Scott Meehan
    Infinite Kind Support

  12. 12 Posted by Gerald Achor on 03 Apr, 2015 08:16 PM

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    Thank you, Scott.

    I think that Des will be pleased also.


  13. 13 Posted by dwg on 03 Apr, 2015 08:43 PM

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    Pleased ??? me???

    No that will never do :)

    I''ll be pleased when I see the priority to address the missing investment transactions reaches the top of the heap and the commitment made to address them.

    At the moment I think the priority is somewhere south of the basement.


  14. 14 Posted by Gerald Achor on 04 Apr, 2015 02:40 PM

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    Well, at least, folks we now have an active ticket assigned to a discussion on this new site of Tender (new site? (G)) on Investment action (commands) that need to be added to make MoneyDance one of the top financial programs found. (For me, something to replace Quicken!! (g))


  15. System closed this discussion on 19 Mar, 2016 04:56 AM.

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