Won't go beyond performing initial sync on iMac

Mark Fennelly's Avatar

Mark Fennelly

03 Nov, 2021 09:08 AM

Hi - I have used Moneydance ok for a few years but when I bought a new MacBook I couldn't install it a year ago so I left it on my iMac only - now my iMac ( which I had to reinstall the iOS) - i can connect to dropbox ok and authorise the app and put the password in etc . it all goes ok until it starts to perform the initial sync - and it goes no further - for days just sits there - I can't do anything more with it and have to quit the app after day and start again - but no joy - have uploaded a screen shot. Hope you can help Thanks Mark

  1. 1 Posted by Stuart Beesley ... on 03 Nov, 2021 09:26 AM

    Stuart Beesley (Mr Toolbox)'s Avatar

    What version of MD? There was a bug in that the dropbox hidden .moneydancesync folder would not get created... Upgrade to the latest version of your licensed app version..

    or... send errlog.txt file....

  2. 2 Posted by dwg on 03 Nov, 2021 09:44 AM

    dwg's Avatar

    Stuart mentions one thing, but I note that you seem to have a lot of Moneydance sync folders on Dropbox, what is the story behind them?

    Also the data set you are trying to sync, when was the sync setup created on the primary system? The reason I ask is IOS can choke if the sync setup was created some time ago.

    If there is only one syncing setup, and what I am seeing are remnants of past set up attempts. I think this could be a good idea to first clean the system up before creating the syncing arrangement.

  3. 3 Posted by Stuart Beesley ... on 03 Nov, 2021 09:49 AM

    Stuart Beesley (Mr Toolbox)'s Avatar

    ... and are you saying you want to connect to an existing Sync from another machine, or start a new sync..?

  4. 4 Posted by Mark Fennelly on 03 Nov, 2021 10:07 AM

    Mark Fennelly's Avatar

    Thanks for the help Guys - very helpful…

    I have the latest version - I noticed another came up today - from a few weeks back

    I can see the list of sync files on dropbox - they don’t have dates to see when last accessed so ill have a go at deleting all but the one at the top and see how I get on

    The sync was set up in December 2019 on Moneydance

    Ill have a go at this and see if it works!

    Thank you

  5. 5 Posted by LarryCL on 22 Jan, 2022 01:18 AM

    LarryCL's Avatar

    I am having a similar problem. I have a primary (Windows 10) that has been successfully syncing with a 2nd PC for a couple of years. Recently I tried adding two additional PCs but each exhibited the same problem as the OP: I get the "Performing Initial Sync" message, but it never completes. As I noted, this failed on two different PCs (running Windows 11) that I tried this on, but it's still successfully syncing between Primary and PC #2. Had to end up killing the app to stop it.

    I am using the latest version of Moneydance and Dropbox sync

  6. 6 Posted by LarryCL on 22 Jan, 2022 01:27 AM

    LarryCL's Avatar

    For what it's worth, I noticed that when my new client was attempting to perform the initial sync, it created a new empty folder (with a long guid name) in the dropbox .moneydancesync folder.
    Now, I don't claim to understand the moneydance syncing mechanism, but shouldn't it be syncing to the existing folder on dropbox and not creating a new one? Seems like this could be a symptom of the bug.

  7. 7 Posted by derekkent23 on 22 Jan, 2022 10:46 AM

    derekkent23's Avatar

    I am not support staff, just a user.
    Hi LarryCL

    To be able to help more information is needed.

    1. Can you confirm you are trying to sync between 4 windows computers?
    2. Are they all running the same version and build of Moneydance, e.g., 2022.3(4069)?
    3. If so what is it?
    4. What sync method are you running, Dropbox Folder or Dropbox Connection?
    5. Are you using a Free Dropbox Account?
    6. Ae all computer using the same Dropbox Account?
    7. Did you set up your primary computer under FILES – SYNCING?
    8. Did you set up all the other computers as secondary computers using FILE – NEW – OPEN SYNCED FILE?

    With this information I should be able to help. Also provide some back ground on how syncing works.

    For example, did you know in you look in the Dropbox there should be one long alphanumeric folder for each data set that has been synced. If you look in this folder you will see a file named mdsyncinfo.txt. Open this file in a text editor and it will tell you the name of the data set it is syncing.

  8. 8 Posted by LarryCL on 22 Jan, 2022 12:12 PM

    LarryCL's Avatar
    1. Can you confirm you are trying to sync between 4 windows computers?
      Yes, let's call the primary (A) & the secondary (B). These have been syncing successfully for quite a while.
      A month ago or so, I tried to sync to a third windows computer (C). That failed as it would not get past the initial sync. I gave up.
      Yesterday I tried again with a different windows computer (D). That also failed to get past initial sync.
      Also, probably not worth mentioning but anyway, I also sync successfully with my Iphone. So I am able to sync to/from (A), (B), and (iphone)

    2. Are they all running the same version and build of Moneydance, e.g., 2022.3(4069)?
      Yes, 2022.2

    3. What sync method are you running, Dropbox Folder or Dropbox Connection?
      Dropbox connection

    4. Are you using a Free Dropbox Account?
      Yes, a free dropbox account

    5. Ae all computer using the same Dropbox Account?
      yes

    6. Did you set up your primary computer under FILES – SYNCING?
      yes

    7. Did you set up all the other computers as secondary computers using FILE – NEW – OPEN SYNCED FILE?
      yes

    did you know in you look in the Dropbox there should be one long alphanumeric folder for each data set that has been synced Yes, that's why I mentioned it in my above post. I see the folder that has my data. What I noticed (and I think is a symptom of the problem is that as soon as I tried to add computer (C) or (D), a new empty folder was created.
    If you look closely at the OP's post, while he didn't mention it, I think the same thing was happening to him.

  9. 9 Posted by derekkent23 on 22 Jan, 2022 03:31 PM

    derekkent23's Avatar

    I am not support staff, just a user.
    Hi LarryCL

    Update the build of Moneydance on each computer to 2022.3(4063) from https://infinitekind.com/preview
    Look like you have done the wright things. So, let’s try to sync computers A, B and C, put D aside for the time being.

    Install Dropbox Client on computers A, B and C if not already installed. Copy a small file (say a word file) to Dropbox folder on Computer A and check the file is synced to the Dropbox folders on Computers B and C.
    Then reset syncing as follows.

    On your iPhone under settings disconnect.

    To reset computer syncing.
    1. Set primary computer “Sync Method” to “Don’t Sync” under FILE– SYNCING, then click OK.
    2. On your primary computer use FILE– EXPORT BACKUP to save a backup in case something goes wrong.
    3. On the secondary computers click on HELP – SHOW DOCUMENT FOLDER to open a file explorer, close Moneydance and delete your second computers data sets “yourdatasetname.moneydance”.
    4. Using your primary computer in the Dropbox folder copy the folder “.moneydancesync” to your hard drive (this copy can be deleted after a successful sync), then in the Dropbox folder delete the contents of the “.moneydancesync” folder so it is empty. Watch the Dropbox icon and wait till it states “Up to Date”. This can talk some time.
    5. On the secondary computers check that in the Dropbox Folder that the folder “.moneydancesync” is now empty. You need to give Dropbox a short time to empty the folder.
    6. On your primary computer under - SYNCING, select DROPBOX FOLDER as the Sync Method then click OK. Now enter the Encryption Password and click OK.
    7. Wait for an alphanumeric folder and its contents to be created in the Dropbox folder “.moneydancesync”. Check the Dropbox icon states “Up to Date”. This can take some time. From now on normal syncing is fast, no need to wait or check.
    8. On the second computers wait until the same Dropbox folder appears, again watch the Dropbox icon this time on your secondary computers and wait till they state “Up to Date”.
    9. On the secondary computers starting Moneydance should open it in the welcome window, click on “Create a new account set”.
    10. Select “Open Synced File” and use dropdown to select “Dropbox Folder” then click NEXT.
    11. You should see a search screen headed “Select a synced document to open”
    12. After a short search delay, it should then list your data set name set up on your primary computer.
    13. Highlight your data set name and click NEXT.
    14. Enter the encryption password, the “Encryption Passphrase” you set on your primary computer under FILE (MONEYDANCE on Mac) – SYNCING. When entered correctly the FINISH button is ungreyed.
    15. Then click on FINISH. Wait for your data to be synced.

    You may find a lot of old, maybe closed accounts or other accounts you have removed from the side bar reappearing in the second computers side bar. Use the “+” sign at bottom of side bar then ADVANCED to tidy up the side bar.

    Then set up syncing on your iPhone as normal.

    If you want to add computer D to the sync you will need to add that using the sync method Dropbox Connect. You have to use Dropbox Connect as you can’t install Dropbox client on more than three computers when you are using a free Dropbox account. You can mix sync methods. Dropbox Folder is the preferred method. If you need help adding Computer D using Dropbox Connection just post

    Hope this helps.

  10. 10 Posted by LarryCL on 23 Jan, 2022 03:19 AM

    LarryCL's Avatar

    derekkent23 thanks so much for the detailed suggestions.
    I will try updating to the preview version you suggested, although I don't see anything about syncing in the release notes. I'll post back after I try it.

    As for the other suggestions, while I do appreciate the suggestions, for a number of reasons I am not going to change the syncing from Dropbox Connect to Dropbox client. Dropbox sync has worked perfectly well in the past, and continues to work between A & B. The bug comes (as I reported earlier) when I try to add additional computers (eg, C, D etc)

    I recognize that you are just user providing support (not support staff), and I appreciate that! I am not trying to sound unappreciative nor rude. But given that Dropbox sync is supposedly one of the fully supported syncing methods, then the fact that it's not working for me nor the OP nor others (there's at least 2 other reports of this) makes me think there's a bug. see https://infinitekind.tenderapp.com/discussions/problems/75487-perfo... and https://infinitekind.tenderapp.com/discussions/problems/73653-dropb...

    I know my way around computers extremely well -- I've worked in tech for 25+ years and I've been a Moneydance user for 10+ years. I can definitively say that this problem is not a user error; it's a bug. What I really need to do (again, not trying to sound disrespectful) is file a bug report with Infinitekind. It's a bug, and they need to fix it.
    (all assuming that the problem is not fixed in the preview release)

  11. 11 Posted by derekkent23 on 23 Jan, 2022 08:53 AM

    derekkent23's Avatar

    I am not support staff, just a user.
    Hi LarryCL

    The reason I use Dropbox Folder rather than Dropbox Connection is based on the following and the fact that Dropbox folder seems faster.

    With Dropbox Connection Moneydance uses the Dropbox API to talk to the Dropbox service directly. So, you don't need to have Dropbox client actually installed on your computer, but you do need to be online when Moneydance is running in order for changes to be synced. Data will be synced once you go back on line when Moneydance is open. With Drobox Folder Moneydance will just read and write files to your Dropbox folder on your computer, which means that you need to have Dropbox client installed and running, but you don't need to be online in order for Moneydance to read and write the changes.” Syncing will occur when you go online, Moneydance does not need to be open.

    After your comments on a bug in Dropbox Connection I thought I would have a go syncing 4 computers using the method Dropbox Connection.

    My set up is as follows:
    1. All computers running 2020.3(4063)
    2. Two Dropbox Accounts with the “.moneydancesyn” folder shared between the two accounts. The reason I have two accounts is that as I normally use the sync method Dropbox Folder I can’t instal Dropbox clients on more than three computers or I would exceed the free Dropbox account limit.
    3. Primary computer Windows 11 on account A.
    4. Two Secondary computers Windows 10 one on account A, the other on account B
    5. A third Secondary computer Linux Ferron on account B.

    I created a new test data set on the primary computer and synced with Dropbox Connection. Then in turn synced the three secondary computers using Dropbox Connection. Each listed the three existing data sets I sync by Dropbox Folder plus the new test data set synced by Dropbox Connection. At the end of the process all four computers were syncing without any issues.
    So, I was not able to reproduce the problem you are seeing.

    Perhaps it would help support to identity the issue if you reported the exact steps you take to sync your third computer and at which step the process fails and what you see.

    It could also be helpful to have the Moneydance console window under HELP open on the primary computer and the new secondary computer you are trying to sync. Save the content of the two console windows to text files and post. Support may be able to identify the issue.

    Hope this helps.

  12. 12 Posted by derekkent23 on 23 Jan, 2022 10:11 AM

    derekkent23's Avatar

    I am not support staff, just a user.
    Hi LarryCL

    As a follow up I wondered if the issue was related to using Dropbox Connection on more than two computers on the same free Dropbox account.

    On my Linux computer which has three portioned operating system Linux Mint uses Dropbox account A. So, I synced using Dropbox Connection to my test data set, no problems. So now when I synced the test data set I have three computer syncing using Dropbox Connection on free Dropbox account A and two on account B. All five just sync. So still can reproduce your issue.

    Hope this helps.

  13. 13 Posted by derekkent23 on 23 Jan, 2022 06:10 PM

    derekkent23's Avatar

    I am not support staff, just a user.
    Hi LarryCL

    Based on my testing and the fact you have been syncing between two computers for a couple of years and in that time updated Moneydance’s builds probably several times you should reset syncing.
    If you don’t want to use Dropbox Folder that OK.
    Do an EXPORT BACKUP on your primary computer and set to don’t sync and close Moneydance,
    Delete your data set on your secondary computer.
    Move “Moneydancesync” folder out of Dropbox to your hard drive, can be deleted once syncing is working.
    Then set primary computer to sync using Dropbox Connection followed by each of your secondary computers again using Dropbox Connection. If my experience with testing is anything to go by this clean up should work.

    Hope this helps.

  14. 14 Posted by LarryCL on 25 Jan, 2022 02:07 AM

    LarryCL's Avatar

    Hi derekkent23,
    I tried the following:
    - On my primary computer, I set Moneydance to not sync - On Dropbox, I renamed the folder.moneydancesync to be .moneydancesync-old - Back on the primary computer, I re-enabled syncing using Dropbox connection. - I waited a bit, then quit moneydance.

    At no point did I receive any error messages from the moneydance app. However, when I looked in dropbox, I could see that it created one subfolder within the .moneydancesync folder with a number of metadata files, however, I did not see any of the actual data within this folder. (See attached screenshot)

    I then looked at the .errlog.txt file within the .moneydance folder on my PC and saw the following, which makes me think there's a dropbox problem somewhere:

    reading trunk data tiksync/trunk
    trunk data loaded (1.657 seconds), checking for incremental updates
    loading un-synced txn files...
    loading synced txn files...
    replacing root: null () with new root: My Finances (c88f95f8-561b-4765-8173-93bdfcfe0238
    error creating base folder: com.dropbox.core.v2.files.CreateFolderErrorException: Exception in 2/files/create_folder: {".tag":"path","path":{".tag":"conflict","conflict":"folder"}}
    starting syncing via encryptedFS(DropboxAPI:/.moneydancesync/d4cd45fc-07c7-4321-b09f-d5358d6c89a9)
    extension moneyforesight took a while (0.295 seconds) to respond to event md:file:opened
    error retrieving txn files: com.dropbox.core.v2.files.ListFolderErrorException: Exception in 2/files/list_folder: {".tag":"path","path":"not_found"}
    com.dropbox.core.v2.files.ListFolderErrorException: Exception in 2/files/list_folder: {".tag":"path","path":"not_found"}
        at com.dropbox.core.v2.files.DbxUserFilesRequests.listFolder(DbxUserFilesRequests.java:1981)
        at com.dropbox.core.v2.files.ListFolderBuilder.start(ListFolderBuilder.java:175)
        at com.moneydance.apps.md.controller.sync.DropboxAPISyncFolder.listFiles(DropboxAPISyncFolder.java:154)
        at com.moneydance.apps.md.controller.sync.EncryptedSyncFolder.listFiles(EncryptedSyncFolder.java:83)
        at com.infinitekind.tiksync.Syncer.pullIncomingTxns(Syncer.java:1012)
        at com.infinitekind.tiksync.Syncer$SyncThread.run(Syncer.java:907)
    Writing file to dropbox API with debug mode=false
    Writing file to dropbox API with debug mode=false
    Update info received with successful signature verification
    Version info retrieved; we are up to date!
    error retrieving txn files: com.dropbox.core.v2.files.ListFolderErrorException: Exception in 2/files/list_folder: {".tag":"path","path":"not_found"}
    com.dropbox.core.v2.files.ListFolderErrorException: Exception in 2/files/list_folder: {".tag":"path","path":"not_found"}
        at com.dropbox.core.v2.files.DbxUserFilesRequests.listFolder(DbxUserFilesRequests.java:1981)
        at com.dropbox.core.v2.files.ListFolderBuilder.start(ListFolderBuilder.java:175)
        at com.moneydance.apps.md.controller.sync.DropboxAPISyncFolder.listFiles(DropboxAPISyncFolder.java:154)
        at com.moneydance.apps.md.controller.sync.EncryptedSyncFolder.listFiles(EncryptedSyncFolder.java:83)
        at com.infinitekind.tiksync.Syncer.pullIncomingTxns(Syncer.java:1012)
        at com.infinitekind.tiksync.Syncer$SyncThread.run(Syncer.java:907)
    Beginning shutdown process
    Shutting down syncing for file
    
    I didn't even try to sync on a second computer because it would be pointless; there's no data in dropbox for the 2nd computer to pull down so I didn't bother.
    So at this point, it seems like syncing via dropbox connection is completely broken unfortunately.
    I doublechecked and I still have 3Gb available in my dropbox account, so I know that's not the problem. Not really sure what else to check at this point.
  15. 15 Posted by LarryCL on 25 Jan, 2022 02:23 AM

    LarryCL's Avatar

    Edit: after posting the above, I used the toolbox extension to convert the file on my computer to be master (somehow it was showing as secondary)
    That got it syncing to Dropbox.
    This, plus having reset the sync per Derek's suggestion, finally got my data syncing again to my additional laptops. Yay! Thanks Derek for all the help.

    One final comment: while I very much appreciate Derek's help on this thread, how do I formally open a support ticket with Moneydance support staff? I could not find an email address for official support. If I do want/need support, is it better to start a new thread? Will that get someone from Moneydance to engage?

  16. 16 Posted by derekkent23 on 25 Jan, 2022 09:00 AM

    derekkent23's Avatar

    I am not support staff, just a user.
    Hi LarryCL

    Glad the process I created for resetting Moneydance sync was helpful.

    Until recent builds it was easy to tell a primary and secondary synced computer. The primary sync method could be changed, but the secondary was fixed and greyed out. But now they look the same.

    You can start with one computer reported by Stuarts third party extension Toolbox as a secondary computer but still set up syncing to another computer thus have two computers reported by Toolbox as both secondary computers. But I would not recommend doing this especially if you change sync methods on the first computer as on testing I got some bad results. I need to do some more testing to ensure the issue is repeatable before reporting to Sean.

    Yes I think it would have help to start a new discussion in attracting support staff’s attention.

    Support staff read these discussions and if advice is incorrect or as confirmation often post as you can see from other discussions on the forum. If appropriate they raise a ticket for the issue to be reported to Sean the Moneydance developer. There is no email address for official support it’s all done on this forum. Long term expert users have access to Sean’s slack and GitHub sites to report issues/bugs.

    Have Fun, Stay Safe.

  17. 17 Posted by Stuart Beesley ... on 11 Feb, 2022 05:23 AM

    Stuart Beesley (Mr Toolbox)'s Avatar

    Toolbox 🧰 +1 😃

  18. Maddy closed this discussion on 11 Feb, 2022 04:48 PM.

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