tag:infinitekind.tenderapp.com,2009-01-14:/discussions/problems/90771-new-cifs-security-forced-serverworkstation-upgrades-now-moneydance-2015-sort-of-works-but-unusableInfinite Kind: Discussion 2023-08-23T23:30:20Ztag:infinitekind.tenderapp.com,2009-01-14:Comment/589871222023-05-21T01:03:39Z2023-05-21T01:04:11ZNew CIFS security forced server/workstation upgrades. Now Moneydance 2015 sort of works but unusable.<div><p>just a user - maybe download the trial version of 2023 onto a test area, and also see if it uploads a backup of your data set? I think 2015 was a pivotal year where "everything changed", but I don't think it has changed much since then (i.e. 2023 could read/upgrade the data), but again - given the knowledge in your post, this might work for you?</p></div>dtdtag:infinitekind.tenderapp.com,2009-01-14:Comment/589871222023-05-21T01:40:43Z2023-05-21T01:40:43ZNew CIFS security forced server/workstation upgrades. Now Moneydance 2015 sort of works but unusable.<div><p>There is no real data upgrade from 2015 to 2023 but there are enough detail changes that you cannot and should not try to go back to 2015 with data that has been opened by 2023.</p>
<p>That being said Moneydance has never really supported storing data on a server of any description. It had tacit support to use Dropbox in this way some years back but there were a lot of provisos, but even then Moneydance was reading/writing locally.</p>
<p>With the introduction of syncing capability in 2017 any sort of server storage became a "not recommended" and personally I think that should be a not supported position, given the problems that are possible and the way Moneydance now handles data.</p>
<p>If you want to share data, use the inbuilt syncing engine and your CIFS server for the data exchange, the way the data exchange portion of Moneydance works is compatible with server storage and has been designed specifically for that.</p></div>dwgtag:infinitekind.tenderapp.com,2009-01-14:Comment/589871222023-05-21T06:59:10Z2023-05-21T06:59:11ZNew CIFS security forced server/workstation upgrades. Now Moneydance 2015 sort of works but unusable.<div><p>Never had a lick of trouble with having two different systems<br>
interfacing single Moneydance data set on server, until latest CIFS<br>
protocol changes pushed me to upgrade all operating systems. Still have<br>
no trouble going between server and client where both are running Leap 15.4.</p>
<p>However, I will look into the syncing engine you mentioned. It's new to<br>
me, but then my use of Moneydance goes all the way back to before it<br>
followed SAP rules and I never change accounting systems until drug<br>
kicking and screaming to it, which has just happened.</p>
<p>I manually enter all transactions, so I don't use the check writing or<br>
banking interface features (just an old curmudgeon set in my ways). I<br>
just looked at my 2015 version and didn't see any obvious reference to<br>
"syncing". When did it come in and is there documentation on it somewhere outside of the program itself?</p>
<p>Thomas Garson<br>
Aural Technology, Ashland, OR<br>
By my calculation, the dynamic range of the universe is roughly 679dB,<br>
which is approximately 225 bits, collected at a rate 1.714287514x10^23 sps.</p></div>tgarsontag:infinitekind.tenderapp.com,2009-01-14:Comment/589871222023-05-21T07:19:02Z2023-05-21T07:19:02ZNew CIFS security forced server/workstation upgrades. Now Moneydance 2015 sort of works but unusable.<div><p>I'm a fellow user.</p>
<p>Syncing was first introduced in Moneydance 2017, subsequent to this it has been further refined and had detail changes to its operation.</p>
<p>Many changes to how Moneydance reads and write data has followed the introduction of syncing with the changes designed to support syncing and local access to the local working copy of the data.</p>
<p>In Moneydance 2015 and earlier many problems with shared storage revolved around accidental attempts at concurrent use or the use of services that would copy files that were in an inconsistent state. As Moneydance has developed we have seen a greater incidence of report problems around sharing of data, at the same time as there has been greater demand to share the data. Moneydance 2015 was a significant turning point in this as the data structure was completely changed from earlier releases in this release in readiness for syncing.</p>
<p>Syncing setup is discussed in the Knowledge Base article:</p>
<p><a href="https://infinitekind.tenderapp.com/kb/syncing-and-sharing-data/syncing-with-other-computers">https://infinitekind.tenderapp.com/kb/syncing-and-sharing-data/sync...</a></p></div>dwgtag:infinitekind.tenderapp.com,2009-01-14:Comment/589871222023-05-21T21:32:03Z2023-05-21T21:32:04ZNew CIFS security forced server/workstation upgrades. Now Moneydance 2015 sort of works but unusable.<div><p>Hi,</p>
<p>Thanks for the info. I'm moving forward with using syncing.</p>
<p>However, I discovered the "smoking gun" at the root of my miseries with<br>
the mint-mate box: There is no samba client configuration ability that I<br>
could find in any of the several levels of that O/S I tried. Even the<br>
most recent version 21.1 has no findable tool for that. I finally opened<br>
up /etc/samba/smb.conf and edited the default WORKGROUP = WORKGROUP to<br>
WORKGROUP = *********** (my workgroup name).</p>
<p>After I rebooted, not only was Moneydance able to open its files, but<br>
overall networking behavior of the system improved.</p>
<p>Prior to applying the correct workgroup name, the system insisted on<br>
adding ".local" to my servers name in a seemingly random fashion. Very<br>
strange behavior to me. I could log onto the server and most things<br>
worked properly but Moneydance didn't. Moneydance is the only Java App I<br>
currently use. Perhaps the issue is related to Javas behavior.</p>
<p>It's also possible this is more than a mint issue. It may also affect<br>
Moneydance behavior in ubuntu and even debian.</p>
<p>Sean, and company, should post a bulletin for users with any sort of<br>
problem connecting via a samba network to make certain that the<br>
workgroup on a workstation is actually set properly to match their network!</p>
<p>Thomas Garson<br>
Aural Technology, Ashland, OR<br>
By my calculation, the dynamic range of the universe is roughly 679dB,<br>
which is approximately 225 bits, collected at a rate 1.714287514x10^23 sps.</p></div>tgarsontag:infinitekind.tenderapp.com,2009-01-14:Comment/589871222023-05-23T19:38:28Z2023-05-23T19:38:29ZNew CIFS security forced server/workstation upgrades. Now Moneydance 2015 sort of works but unusable.<div><p>Problem Resolved:<br>
While not as I had hoped to do it, I can get back to work.<br>
Thanks to all who offered assistance. It was very useful.</p>
<p>I gave up on Ubuntu-Mint-Mate as a viable system, at least for me.<br>
I formatted the Linux partitions and installed openSUSE Leap 15.4.<br>
The install was relatively painless, partly because It was deja vu all over again.</p>
<p>In Leap, YAST provided al of the necessary operations required to properly configure the system for connecting to my small network as a SAMBA client. I added SMB4K, as I always do, to simplify the process of logging on to the SAMBA shares from my server.</p>
<p>Once the networking setup was completed correctly, which I was unable to accomplish with Mint-Mate, I installed Moneydance with its data copied to my "home directory" and was able to successfully point the sync agent to the correct directory on my server.</p>
<p>Important rule for use still seems to be one user at a time since it appears updates from a user happen in a batch at the end of a session, rather than in real time. If true, I'm OK with that as that's how I was able to share use of one MD file between two users prior to having the sync engine.</p>
<p>Hopefully, this is my last post to this discussion :-)</p></div>tgarsontag:infinitekind.tenderapp.com,2009-01-14:Comment/589871222023-05-23T21:30:39Z2023-05-23T21:30:39ZNew CIFS security forced server/workstation upgrades. Now Moneydance 2015 sort of works but unusable.<div><p>Syncing updates should occur about every 20 seconds.</p>
<p>Moneydance writes out it small transaction update files (txn files) then the software does a comparison between what is held locally and what is in the shared location, updates files accordingly by using a copy operation then, if it needs to, applies any updates to the local machine.</p></div>dwgtag:infinitekind.tenderapp.com,2009-01-14:Comment/589871222023-05-24T01:54:12Z2023-05-24T01:54:13ZNew CIFS security forced server/workstation upgrades. Now Moneydance 2015 sort of works but unusable.<div><p>Hi dwg,</p>
<p>Yes! I figured it out that updates were near real time after spending<br>
more time working with MD today. Of course, that was after my previous<br>
post. I love it. Moneydance has evolved into a true multi user program.</p>
<p>Overall, although I went through Computer Purgatory, and nearly to Hell,<br>
it wasn't the fault of Moneydance, or even me (mostly). Today, I did a<br>
normal daily entry session in the afternoon with all positive results.</p>
<p>FWIW: I originally chose mint-mate for the laptop because it was<br>
purported to operate very much like Windows, which my wife was familiar<br>
with because of her workplace. I have to say, they one upped Windows as<br>
virtually all tools to do more than the most basic configuration and<br>
setup were stripped away. That concept worked, seven years ago...<br>
Perhaps if mint-mate were installed on a system that was otherwise<br>
homogenic Microsoft, its default configuration would be sufficient. It<br>
uses SAMBA client (a necessity) for SMB/CIFS networking but seems to<br>
expect a Windows server.</p>
<p>Thomas Garson</p></div>tgarsontag:infinitekind.tenderapp.com,2009-01-14:Comment/589871222023-05-24T02:14:09Z2023-05-24T02:14:09ZNew CIFS security forced server/workstation upgrades. Now Moneydance 2015 sort of works but unusable.<div><p>Even in a Windows environment SAMBA can be a challenge at times.</p>
<p>I rather like Mint with the MATE desktop, fortunately it has been some years since I needed to look at SAMBA.</p></div>dwgtag:infinitekind.tenderapp.com,2009-01-14:Comment/589871222023-05-24T16:41:18Z2023-05-24T16:41:18ZNew CIFS security forced server/workstation upgrades. Now Moneydance 2015 sort of works but unusable.<div><p>I suspect, but can't prove as I don't use Windows for servers, that the<br>
default mint-mate SAMBA networking setup is intentionally "Windows<br>
friendly". It is very telling that the only way in mint-mate you can<br>
change WORKGROUP = WORKGROUP is by directly editing smb.conf.</p>
<p>The Linux world is very "open" so there is nothing wrong with that<br>
approach. However, they should make it more obvious that their distro is<br>
specifically designed to seamlessly merge into networks which are<br>
Windows centric and, by default, devoid of normal tools for altering that.</p>
<p>I did play with mate on a server running openSUSE Leap 15.1, which came<br>
with YAST installed. The tools in YAST enabled me to configure SAMBA as<br>
necessary for a world that is sufficiently Windows compatible that the<br>
few workstations I have which run Windows natively, or via VMWare, were<br>
happy. That configuration worked OK with mint-mate up to 19.3. When I<br>
updated the server to Leap 15.4, in order to provide the latest CIFS<br>
security features, mint-mate 19.3 lost the ability to SAMBA with that<br>
server. Upgrading mint-mate sequentially to the current 21.3 level gave<br>
no relief for that. I'm sure that a veteran Debian/Ubuntu guru could<br>
have installed the required tools and corrected the problem. For me, it<br>
became a no brainer to dump mint-mate and go with openSUSE+KDE, which I<br>
did and had minimal difficulties getting everything working.</p>
<p>Thomas Garson</p></div>tgarsontag:infinitekind.tenderapp.com,2009-01-14:Comment/589871222023-05-24T19:44:22Z2023-05-24T19:44:22ZNew CIFS security forced server/workstation upgrades. Now Moneydance 2015 sort of works but unusable.<div><p>It’s a very ‘standard’ thing that your workgroup name needs to be set; this therefore includes Samba…</p></div>Stuart Beesley (Mr Toolbox)tag:infinitekind.tenderapp.com,2009-01-14:Comment/589871222023-05-24T22:38:36Z2023-05-24T22:38:36ZNew CIFS security forced server/workstation upgrades. Now Moneydance 2015 sort of works but unusable.<div><p>It gets more complicated if you need to work in a Windows domain environment, all my work in SAMBA required editing the various config files and there were no tools available when I was looking at it in detail. This was in pre Mint, Ubuntu etc days working with RH, Slackware and the like.</p></div>dwgtag:infinitekind.tenderapp.com,2009-01-14:Comment/589871222023-05-24T23:28:46Z2023-05-24T23:28:47ZNew CIFS security forced server/workstation upgrades. Now Moneydance 2015 sort of works but unusable.<div><p>Stuart,</p>
<p>I absolutely agree. From my perspective, setting WORKGROOP is one of the<br>
configuration features that mint-mate lacks. My guess is that CIFS prior to 3.0 allowed WORKGROUP identification to be somewhat lax. There<br>
may be other "holes" that CIFS 3.0 plugged as well. I'm no SAMBA expert.<br>
I would still be at NT 1 if it were easily configurable but those days<br>
are long gone. Likely, Windows Server comes configured to go to great<br>
lengths to connect to Windows clients running XP, maybe even 2K.<br>
Mint-mate tries to look like that. My impression is that the latest<br>
SAMBA may actually follow the CIFS 3.0 rules tighter than Microsoft does<br>
with their server software. It's all OK, at least for now. I've brought<br>
my network out of the "dark ages" by allowing the server to require<br>
strict adherence to current "max" protocol, then reconfigured clients to<br>
comply.</p>
<p>For now, it all works. Probably in another 5 years, or so, I'll have to<br>
go through it all over again with CIFS 4.0, or whatever version will be<br>
provided as default on server distros.</p>
<p>Sigh.</p>
<p>Thomas Garson</p>
<p>On 5/24/23 12:44, Stuart Beesley (Mr Toolbox) wrote:</p></div>tgarson